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Post by Jonjel on Nov 7, 2014 14:37:58 GMT
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Post by cleefarqhuar on Nov 7, 2014 18:00:14 GMT
I wonder why they consider it necessary to have a separate burial ground?
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pippop
pc
I love everyone here.
Posts: 1,110
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Post by pippop on Nov 7, 2014 23:52:05 GMT
Jonjel. I agree with you; I don't care much what happens to me when I am dead.
So why do you think that this story in the newspaper is "interesting"?
Surely it's of no interest whatsoever to people like us?
Also, may I be bold enough to ask: you don't live in Birmingham do you? So how come you're reading that newspaper?
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Post by jean on Nov 8, 2014 8:37:02 GMT
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Post by marchesarosa on Nov 8, 2014 16:42:21 GMT
Tell us more about this cemetery, jean. Where is it, for example? Is it exclusively for jews?
Looks to me like they may be war graves in a section that is hedged off from the rest.
What has this to do with a 4000 plot or 7000 plot cemetery exclusively for muslims in a green belt village near Solihull? And why all the brouhaha from muslims over purported "Islamaphobia" of the Planning Committee when the application was turned down?
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Post by jean on Nov 9, 2014 14:05:17 GMT
It is East Ham Jewish Cemetery, first burial 1919. It does have a section for war graves. I do not know much about it but I wanted an image which would make it clear to you that religious groups other than Muslims have long had cemeteries of their own. When I lived in London, I used to walk past one particular Jewish cemetery every day on my way to work. I'm not going to tell you exactly where it is, but it has separate sections for Ashkenazi and Sephardic burials. The Sephardim favour slightly raised, flat memorial tablets without headstones, like these. It probably looks neater if they're all together:
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Post by jean on Nov 9, 2014 14:30:43 GMT
On the more general question of whether putting any sort of cemetery in Green Belt land would be a violation of its status, I have never given this matter any thought up to now. When I lived in Poland, the nearest thing we had to a public park where I lived was the Central Cemetery. I used to walk there a lot. It was beautiful, but then it had far more trees than you'd normally find in a cemetery in this country.
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Post by Jonjel on Nov 9, 2014 14:31:03 GMT
Jonjel. I agree with you; I don't care much what happens to me when I am dead. So why do you think that this story in the newspaper is "interesting"? Surely it's of no interest whatsoever to people like us? Also, may I be bold enough to ask: you don't live in Birmingham do you? So how come you're reading that newspaper? And I will answer you. The reason I flagged it up is because I think that to have a cemetery, school workplace or just about anywhere else dedicated to one particular sect simply gives fuel to the idiot brigade who see this as just another reminder of 'them' and 'us'. I am a firm believer in a secular state. if people want to gather together in one place or another and mutter spells to an imaginary friend they are at liberty to do so, as long as I as a non believer am allowed to go into that Temple Church Mosque or whatever, and I have been in all of them and have never been refused admission. They very often encompass the best art and architecture of a particular age. The Jewish cemetery pictured by Jean has as far as I know been in use for decades. However that was founded in different times, and I hope we have moved on from there. I also hope that if planning for a similar cemetery was put forward today, whether that be Jewish Christian or anything else it would be refused. You might as well go back to the worst times in some states in the US where black people were never buried alongside white. Why did I read that paper? I read papers on line occasionally from all kinds of places, so please don't read anything sinister into that.
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Post by jean on Nov 9, 2014 21:29:20 GMT
I am a firm believer in a secular state. So am I, and I think that educating children in separate religious institutions - whether Christian, Jewish or Muslim - is extremely damaging. But I don't think dead people can do much harm.
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Post by Jonjel on Nov 10, 2014 9:05:14 GMT
But I don't think dead people can do much harm.
Exactly Jean! Regardless of sect.
And secular education is something I would insist is part of the mandate of any political party. I find it a little amusing that once someone is elected they seem to 'find god'.
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Post by cleefarqhuar on Nov 10, 2014 9:44:33 GMT
[ And secular education is something I would insist is part of the mandate of any political party. I do not understand why you 'secularists' insist on chucking away a major part of our heritage and culture
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Post by Jonjel on Nov 10, 2014 9:47:43 GMT
[ And secular education is something I would insist is part of the mandate of any political party. I do not understand why you 'secularists' insist on chucking away a major part of our heritage and culture I can't believe you are serious. The only thing in this world that has killed more people than religion is influenza, and we are looking for a cure for that.
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Post by lovelovelove on Nov 10, 2014 9:50:58 GMT
[ And secular education is something I would insist is part of the mandate of any political party. I do not understand why you 'secularists' insist on chucking away a major part of our heritage and culture Not chucking anything away.Just don't want it rammed down our throats.
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Post by jean on Nov 10, 2014 9:56:00 GMT
I do not understand why you 'secularists' insist on chucking away a major part of our heritage and culture No-one is suggesting pulling down all the churches, temples, synagogues and mosques, cleefy. Or preventing people from worshipping whoever they want to worship however they like. Religion as part of our 'culture' is safe so long as its practitioners want it to be (and so long as they allow jonjel in to admire the artwork). But the education of children within the narrow confines of their parents' religious beliefs is not something the state should encourage.
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theArchbishopofCanterbury
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Post by theArchbishopofCanterbury on Nov 10, 2014 10:53:13 GMT
I do not understand why you 'secularists' insist on chucking away a major part of our heritage and culture I can't believe you are serious. The only thing in this world that has killed more people than religion is influenza, and we are looking for a cure for that. Very goo d point. A cure for religion would be fab.
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